At 1:34 am -0500 20/3/02, Seth Dillingham wrote:
>
[snip]
>My "preferred course of action," as I mentioned above, is to keep
>the prices for everything low, and build a developer (and user!)
>community around our software.
I think (a low) price is crucial for individuals and small
businesses. Whether this is the market to go for is another
question. I'm happy to (continue to) pay my monthly subscription fee
for a Macrobyte-hosted option. I would be prepared to pay a similar
sort of monthly subscription if I hosted Conversant on my own server
if this subscription entitles the user to updates. Basically along
the lines of Userland's policy for example.
Perhaps a sliding (upward) scale of subscription for self-hosted
(ISP) sites that resell their Conversant cycles.
I think some form of educational discount would be a very good idea -
but then I'd say that wouldn't I?
>
>So how do we make a living? That's the question.
>
>Sales of our software. Support constracts? (How much?) Non-free
>developers program? (How much?) Hosting services? Consulting
>services for continuing to improve our software?
I suppose some of this depends on the overheads of keeping
Conversant going on on your own server rather than hosted with you.
I have no idea how much babysitting Conversant requires for example.
Since it's built on Frontier/Radio you have both the advantages and
disadvantages of that particular platform.
Does Digital Creations, for instance, actually make money with Zope
consultation now they've 'open-sourced' Zope?
Can Conversant 'compete' in the same space as
Radio/RCS/Frontier/Manila? There's no doubt that Macrobyte (and
friends) have an excellent reputation for support and responsiveness
to user requests. Can this be scaled and still maintain that
excellent reputation. I doubt it unless a supportive community
develops. Perhaps that community is Script Meridian?
You may recall a private e-mail I sent some months ago in which I
questioned the long-term viability of UserTalk and other Userland
proprietary technologies. To a great exten that's been resolved by
the Userland and their aggressive push based on the $0 RCS (and the
pricing of Radio). Rather ironically, it's the $0 mindbombshell that
looks likely to do most collateral damage to Conversant's prospects.
If I interpret correctly what you've said elsewhere, you are less
reliant on some of these technologies than we might imagine. Some
sort of exit/port strategy would be good insurance - both for
Macrobyte and its customers.
Does/can Conversant compete with and/or augment Manila/RCS? Would
you want it to? As has already been pointed in other replies, the
pricing of Radio and RCS places constraints on the pricing of
Conversant. But these questions aren't helpful to you. I'm sorry for
digressing....
I don't believe that charging a lot for the software will work. We
don't have a sales or marketing budget. That means we have to build a
community, and work with the other developers to "get the word out".
>
>I don't believe that charging a lot for the software will work. We
>don't have a sales or marketing budget. That means we have to build
>a community, and work with the other developers to "get the word
>out".
Buildng and sustaining the community is key. On the plus side there
are lots of new (Radio/UserTalk) users and it's great to see new
faces pop up. As Sam R says, developers will also need to hedge
their bets. I guess if/when demand picks up it'll be for the
perl/python/php developers first and foremost. UserTalk is very much
a niche and its testamount to its power, flexibility, and fun, that
there are so many of the old-guard still around.
How Conversant fits into a developer's portfolio is an interesting,
and thorny, question. I don't know, not being a developer, but here
are some suggestions:
* Developers adopt Conversant as their primary support tool to
support bug-tracking, feature-requests, internal team coordination,
documentation, etc. Any developer worth their salt will be able to
host their own Conversant site(s). In this role, Conversant need not
be related in any way to the application being supported. Think of
the way Macrobyte and its contract workforce have benefited from the
use of Conversant to coordinate/document your own efforts. Build on
that experience. Macrobyte has always struck me as being a large,
well organised, entity due to the way the Conversant has been used to
support yourselves as well as us, your customers. Build on that
strength. Developers can build into their support contracts
sufficient overheads to bear the (modest in relative terms) cost of
Conversant. I would imagine the one thing single-person developers
value most apart from income is the ability to leverage their time
effectively and to support their customers most cost-effectively.
The newly introduced secure server capabilities are an essential
feature here due to concerns about hosting commercially confidential
information, etc.
* Introduce some sort of sliding scale price structure that reflects
the fact that more clients mean more work/support so that Conversant
is priced according to ability to pay (since developers can bill more
clients) and what level of functionality is required. Like your
appraoch to hosting options for instance.
* Create some typical support site type templates. Make it a
no-brainer choice for small developers. Conversant can be tailored
to create great looking support sites with lots of options. The
thing I value most about Conversant is how it saves my time. That's
my most precious commodity. Offer to work with some developers to
create these time-saving features.
* Userland is concentrating on supporting individual writers/bloggers
with Radio/RCS. Macrobyte could concentrate on supporting individual
developers. What are the fundamental differences between the two
constituents. Identify and plug(-in ;-)) any gaps.
Other suggestions:
* Academic mavericks such as myself should be encouraged to use
Conversant to support teaching and learning. In my case, I don't
need much encouragement. Exposing students to the technology will,
hopefully, spin-off further sales when they leave school. The
encouragement may be in the form of educational discounts.
* Try to consolidate the Conversant documentation into a manual/PDF
format. Encourage existing Conversanters to write up their
experience and produce some case studies that can be used to 'sell'
Conversant. Some have already done this. Others, like me, have been
full of good intentions but need "go fetch a stick" ;-)
* Write some white papers about the architecture of Conversant and
how/where developers may tailor it to their own devices and
incorporate it into their own work-flows. Push the XML-RPC
interoperability angle.
* Update the home page of www.macrobyte.net ;-) At the moment it
doesn't look like you eat you own dogfood there!
* Have story/plan of how totally dynamic sites might be migrated to
(partially) static sites. Especially important if some of the sites
have a short dynamic life whilst they are actively in development but
may have a much longer static life where little/nothing gets updated.
For instance, as might occur with a student assignment.
* Have a story/plan of how Conversant might interplay/support
Radio-generated sites, and provide discussion capabilities. A tricky
one this since it competes in the same space as RCS/Manila.
>
>My friend (or possibly two of them) thinks that we should charge
>more for the software, simply because its so good. It's worth it, so
>charge for it. The point has been made that we'll have to sell quite
>a few copies of Conversant at an annual subscription, in order to
>keep the business growing.
>
>I counter with the fact that a higher price makes it a much harder
>sell. (In fact, the same friend has told me to both raise the price
>*and* do more to cater to the low-end of the customer spectrum.)
>
>I want to trust the developers to work with us, to be honorable and
>help us all to succeed. This may be a weakness, a flaw.
You have done an amazing amount of work in developing Conversant.
Other honourable developers will want to stand on your shoulders and
not on your toes ;-) Any developer that is considering rolling their
own system like Conversant is seriously misguided. If you pick your
(initial) partners carefully I don't see a problem. If you
concentrate on the smaller developers then they won't each your lunch.
>This is a crazy way to do business, I know, but I'm looking for
>opinions. If you're a developer who might be interested in working
>with our software (anything I listed), or a user who might want to
>install it (at your company), please speak up. Your opinions may
>help shape Macrobyte's future.
Most of the other comments I was going to make have been covered by
others. More lucidly and succinctly than I would have managed.
Far from being a stupid way to do business it highlights your
integrity. Not being a developer or a champion in a large, rich,
corporation, all I can offer is support and encouragement and
perhaps, in the not too distant future, the prospect of licensing
fees from an educational establishment or two. You certainly deserve
to succeed. Best wishes for whatever direction you take.
>Do you have a site of your own? I invite you to post your thoughts
>there, and send me the URL. I'll link to it. If not, then feel free
>to reply here (
http://www.truerwords.net/1801/reply).
>
>If nothing else, speaking up now will give you a chance to say,
>"See, I was right!" when we succeed -- or fail -- with whatever plan
>we go with.
>
>Thanks for listening. Now I'm listening.
I hope some of the above helps.
All the best,
Duncan
